sex before the fall in the garden?

garden sex

I think god caught them b4 they realized on what to do w/ their privates.

yes It says they became "one flesh".

probably.

sorry MM, that was inserted by the writer, after the fact,, it has nothing to do with the rest of the story, it was just plopped in thier by moses or whomever as to an explanation for why man and woman were concidered one flesh when they were married, A&E were never married, but they were made for one another, ahh if that was only true today.

The first time it is mentioned in scripture is Gen 4:1 "Adam lay with his wife Eve and she became pregnant and gave birth to Cain."

So, we know it occured after they left the garden. There is no other reference previous to this - and no where else is it refered back to knowing anything other than the serpent tempting Eve in the garden - so the concluson is subjective. It is generally difficult to establish an occurance of something that is NOT written about as fact - unless the denial of it conflicts with latter statements. For instance - Cain had to get his wife somewhere - the text does not list all of A&E's children, nor does it offer additional creations. But it does give an account of the heavens and the earth when they were created - and only talks of Adam and Eve.
So - here too, if it bothers to mention it as the first accout of what happened after they were banished, and it occured before that - would it have already been mentioned?

Another perspective would be - what is the argument "against" their having been "sexually active"?

well as you say, there is no concrete evidence that is stated, so i'll just take as my own personal understanding of what other things took place as to my take on the idea that they did not have sex. thnx eljay.

If you believe that they are fictitious characters in a book that is also fictitious, then what would it matter? Their lives would not be real outside of the scripture. If you do believe that Adam and Eve actually walked the earth, then I would see no reason for them not to have sexual relations outside of what is actually detailed in the bible. They were created as young, healthy adults and humans have a natural drive to procreate and sex is fun and it feels nice. Very specific hormones are released during the courtship phase that have other effects on the body as well. Human sexuality is very complicated and its not solely bound up in reproduction.

Otherwise, why would Yahweh have designed Eve with a clitoris? The clitoris has NO other function beyond that of the express purpose of sexual arousal.

That would be a view point from examining the present to determine the past - and a valid one.
I think that Tribo is asking the question in relation to finding the answer in the text of the bible itself. Not that he is not looking for the type of response that you have offered - but his concern is not with whether the characters are ficticious or not - the premise is that they exist in the book. It is more a matter of whether or ot the text establishes a definirive time, and if it is pre-fall or post.

I can't help but be curious, how do you know this?

I was just offering the response as another point of view and not to Tribo specifically. Sorry I guess I should have stated that. No problem. You are well aware that my opinion is that it is a fictional account so the characters themselves are non existent and a figment of the writer's imagination. However, like ANY work of fiction, we are only able to determine the motivations of the characters or protagonist by the actions they take in the context of the story specifically. The same would apply with a screenplay as Im sure you are familiar with based on your occupation. Although in that case, its purely visual and the plot must be moved forward from that perspective solely.

i was going by 2 things spider, 1 - eljays response to my question stating "was this something the writer had done for the readers benifit? - to which you can read eljays reply, 2 - its very to see that it has no connection between toe afore mentioned verse orh the verse(s) after the statement.

1) Eljay's comment is that when Adam and Eve first had intercourse is not made explicit. It could be before or after the fall. As Eljay said, it's subjective.

2) I don't know which two verses you are talking about, but I would guess Genesis 2:24 and Genesis 4:1. They don't contradict one another, therefore they can be complimentary. In other words, they had sex before the fall and Eve didn't get pregnant, but when they had sex after the fall, she did.

This question is really unanswerable. I guess it's fun to debate, but since there is no answer, an reasonable assumption shouldn't be dismissed. I think that MirrorMirror could be right.

I think they would have, given enough time..just like all the other animals in Eden did...however, after becoming aware of themselves, they liked getting "jiggy", so they got kicked out...

no spidey me and eljay were talking of why this verse was plopped in between verses 23 and 25 it just comes out of the blue my original question that was answered by eljay was about where this concept of mother came from since adam and eve did not have a "mother" so how could adam say something which he himself was not even able to do? being "leaving his mother" he had none to leave therfore he was not able to accomplish that which was being stated - therefore i asked eljay or anyone how could thisbe being stated by one who could not even do it? the answer was it was for the readers sake it was being stated by moses and he was putting forth the concept that was later developed by the laws. or do you have another take on this?

Maybe next time you will be so nice as to supply a link to another thread if it's required to understand a new thread?

My take is this: Moses was inspired by God to write the first five books of the Bible. Much of it was experienced directly by Moses, but some parts were imparted to Moses by God. Genesis, in it's entirety, was imparted by God. I believe that Genesis 2:24 is God's commentary on marriage. I don't believe that it would have been written by Moses as such, because polygamy was very popular in Moses' day and Genesis 2:24 is pretty clear that marriage should be between one man and one woman. If Moses were simply trying to control the people, the way wouldn't have been to make polygamy out to be against God's plan for marriage.

i don't remember the thread spidey, thats why i did not include it!!

it was not a question of whether god was saying it - it was the fact that is was "plopped" into the text without any revelence to all else surrounding it - that's the point!!you can clearly see that if you read before and after the statement leaving the statement out that it is not interrupted - the statement is an interruption, that was why i questioned if and why adam would have said it. he did not - it was an after thought by the writer in my opinion, put in at the time the book was written down - whether god said it or not.

Then you could have mentioned that there was another thread? Or clarified the situation in another way. It's just kind of annoying to have your entire post ignored because someone feels that you didn't do your required reading.

It's not out of place, that's your opinion, which I think is clearly wrong.

Adam and Eve are given to each other and Adam said "She's my flesh".

Commentary about the purpose of marriage.

Exposition about Adam and Eve being naked and not caring.

Genesis 2:25 stands out more than Genesis 2:24. You appear to be under the impression that Genesis 2:23 didn't constitute a marriage between Adam and Eve, but it's widely accepted that Genesis 2:23 was Adam and Eve's marriage. After describing the first marriage ceremony, we get a little commentary on what constitutes a marriage. Not out of context and it's completely relevant although it is a side note.