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| Topic: Foresight Theory | |
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If humans are merely extensions of the universe and we are all tied into the universe in some way, why would we have this "foresight" ability rather than actually seeing the future?
...merely? 
First, that article was as shallow as a puddle on a piece of tin and was speaking about optical illusion etc. It had no connection to quantum theory etc. There are those who claim that we can "see" into the future and indeed have done that. It was called the The Montauk Project ~and the Philadelphia Experiment. For more information: http://www.v-j-enterprises.com/montauk.html When I lived in Las Vegas I picked up a book about it called "Thin Air." I must say, I was convinced there was something going on there. This is not just science fiction. JB There is an offer to give 1 million dollars to anyone who can prove the supernatural. The offer has stood for decades. They cannot see the future, they are frauds. Sorry. |
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Edited by
Abracadabra
on
Mon 06/02/08 02:28 PM
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There is an offer to give 1 million dollars to anyone who can prove the supernatural. The offer has stood for decades. They cannot see the future, they are frauds. Sorry. I'm surprised hearing this kind of rhetoric coming from you Spider. This would be like saying that since no one has ever proved the existence of then there cannot be a God. All concepts of God are fraud. Sorry You're starting to sound like Funches. 
People who believe in God can hardly say that anything that has not yet been proven is a fraud. That very sentiment would deny their own faith in the supernatural world. No one had ever proven that praying works either. So by your reasoning then prayer is a fraud. Sorry. (I'm not claiming this, I'm just saying that this is in-line with your reasoning here that anything unproven is necessarily fraudulent.) |
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I read these things and all I can think is "man am I an idiot." Don't have near the brainpower to grasp some of these concepts. What they need to do is extend that 1/10th of a second into an amount of time that I could use, like say a week.
We are part of the universe sure, but is it part of us, no. That's just silly. That's the same as saying we are part of the atoms that make up this fragile human form. Are they part of us, yes, but not the other way around. I can look at my cellular structure, but I cannot be among it. Of course part of me believes that in this particular instance, someone is putting way too much thought into something of ablsolutely no consquence. What difference does it make? How is this knowledge going to enhance our (collective) lives? It would be like actually finding scientific proof as to whether there is (or is not) a god. Okay, now you have the knowledge, what good did it do you? You were better off with just the theory huh? |
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There is an offer to give 1 million dollars to anyone who can prove the supernatural. The offer has stood for decades. They cannot see the future, they are frauds. Sorry. I'm surprised hearing this kind of rhetoric coming from you Spider. This would be like saying that since no one has ever proved the existence of then there cannot be a God. All concepts of God are fraud. Sorry You're starting to sound like Funches.
People who believe in God can hardly say that anything that has not yet been proven is a fraud. That very sentiment would deny their own faith in the supernatural world. No one had ever proven that praying works either. So by your reasoning then prayer is a fraud. Sorry. (I'm not claiming this, I'm just saying that this is in-line with your reasoning here that anything unproven is necessarily fraudulent.) Abra, You can demonstrate that someone lacks precognitive abilities though simple tests. Everyone who currently claims to see the future, but refuses to prove it under scientific conditions, is a fraud. Since God has not presented himself for testing, your analogy is critically flawed. Prayer is another situation altogether. There are two forces at work in prayer, that's why it's called spiritual warfare. Since the negative force cannot be quantified, there is no way to prove or disprove prayer as a force in our world. There are studies that suggest that religious people and especially people who are deeply religious are healtier, happier and live longer lives. There has been little success with tests of prayer in specific instances, but as I have stated, there are two sides to the war and one side has a vested interest in prayer appearing ineffectual. |
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So, if I tell people I can see the future I am not really lying.
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Orator wrote:
What they need to do is extend that 1/10th of a second into an amount of time that I could use, like say a week.
You have me rolling on the floor. I can certainly identify with you sentiment here. Orator wrote:
How is this knowledge going to enhance our (collective) lives? I’m with you 100% on this one. I don’t do it for the enhancement. I do it much the same way other people do crossword puzzles. It’s just fun. To me, science and mathematics are just like interactive mystery novels or fantasy games where you are constantly solving problems to make it to the next level. I do it purely for the fun of it, and the curiosity of what makes things tick. When I was quite young I took our power lawnmower all apart to see what was inside of it. My mother took conniptions when she saw all the pieces laying around the basement floor. A while later I had it all back together again and was mowing the lawn with it. It didn’t run any better for the effort. But at least I knew what was going on inside of it now. I found a certain amount of personal satisfaction in that. Everything we do doesn’t need to enhance us. How many people are enhanced by sitting around watching sitcoms? Probably not too many. Yet they still do it. 
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please explain how a "theory" proves or disproves anything...?
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Edited by
Abracadabra
on
Mon 06/02/08 03:11 PM
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Everyone who currently claims to see the future, but refuses to prove it under scientific conditions, is a fraud. Since God has not presented himself for testing, your analogy is critically flawed.
But I wasn’t talking about God. I was talking about people who claim to believe in a God. And those who claim to know God exists like they know, that they know, that they know, that they know! So there’s no flaws in my analogy at all. 
You claim that psychics are a fraud because they can’t prove what they claim to believe is the same as claiming that everyone is a fraud who can’t prove what they claim to believe. It really has nothing to do with God other than God can be one of the things that people claim to know something about. By your analogies it’s all about what people claim to know. It’s not about the thing they are claiming to know. People who claim to be physic can’t prove that they are. People who claim that a God works wonders in their lives can prove that he does. And this is a perfect analogy because we see people who claim to be very religious have tons of bad things happen to them. That would be the same as a physic who claims to be able to tell the future but can’t really do it. I don’t see any difference at all. Two different people claiming two different things neither of which can come up with any proof to support their claims. Its not about God, it’s about the people and what they are claiming. In other words, if you are calling psychics frauds because they can’t prove their claims, then you must also call religious people frauds because they can’t prove their claims. There’s not flawed. It’s a perfect analogy. Where’s CreativeSoul? Tell him we’ve at least found a perfect analogy.
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Abra,
If I claim to be able to see the future, you can prove me wrong. If I worship an invisible God, you cannot prove that said God does not exist. I get sick to my stomach when I read the drivel that you type. I don't see how you can even hit "Post Topic" after typing that crap. |
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Edited by
Jeanniebean
on
Mon 06/02/08 03:42 PM
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There are those who claim that we can "see" into the future and indeed have done that.
That's very interesting Jeannie, and as ironic as this may sound there are ways to know the future inspire of the fact that it's 'scientifically' impossible. Science is concerned with physics. All science is saying is that the physical world cannot be predetermined. Physically speaking (i.e. Using only the laws of physics) However, I can blow that away very easily. On Saturday at the beach, I can predict that on Monday morning I'll be sitting at my desk at work. That's a prediction of the future! Well, if come Monday morning I find myself sitting at my desk at work who can say that I haven't foretold the future? Of course, we all know that a myriad of other things could have happened. I could have drowned on Saturday at the beach for example. So it's not a really great method of predicting the future, and it only works well if I'm actually expecting something to happen. However we can take this a bit further. Suppose that a man is planning to rape a kill a little girl. He is thinking about doing this and has a vision in his mind of doing it precisely the way he is planning on doing it. So a psychic picks up on this mans thoughts. She sees what he is envisioning in his mind. She sees the future that he is planning. And so she predicts it based on his vision. She states the prediction before it happens, and then it actually happens. In this way it appears that she actually saw into the future. But in reality she actually saw someone else's vision of what the were planning to do in the future. If the Law of Attraction is true. This may actually happen in a lot of cases. People who have bad accidents may actually be dreaming about them or subconsciously thinking about them prior to them happening. This is how they attracted them in the first place. The psychic sees the current vision of the accident and thwarts it. How could the psychic see into the future? She didn't! What she actually saw was someone's vision attracting a future event. I just now thought of this. 
What appears to be vision into the future can actually be visions into the "now" of other people's visions of what they are about to attract or actually do. Whadda think Jeannie?
I don't think a psychic reads another person's intentions alone, ~~but that is a possibility I would not rule out. I have had telepathic communication with others, and I think that would fall into that category. I would hate to be psychic and have a telepathic connection with a serial killer or child rapists. I think a psychic can actually read the event as it exists in the matrix about to happen and she can also read events, past and future surrounding that person or place. I have a very close personal friend that can do this. I know it is possible. As far as predicting a future event, you have to think in terms of the non existence of time. Everything is "Now." A psychic reads "now." She does not read the future. It is the same with the tarot cards, or signs etc. But what is "now" in the matrix looks like the future to the tarot cards or a psychic because it has not actually manifested yet in the physical world. It may well have manifested in the astral or dream matrix already. When I read tarot, the cards reflect the energy of the present moment and all of the repercussions, (cause and effect energies) that go with that energy. Reading tarot is similar to the reading of "signs." If a certain sign means something special to the reader, it will appear when certain energies are present. That is what the reader notices. It stands out to the reader as having a meaning. Every tarot card reader has a different and personal system of symbols (pictures, signs etc.) that mean specific things to them, while they may not mean the same thing to other tarot card readers. Events are created first in the mind worlds and some never actually manifest in the physical world you live in, some may manifest in some alternate reality/dimension. JB |
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There is an offer to give 1 million dollars to anyone who can prove the supernatural. The offer has stood for decades. They cannot see the future, they are frauds. Sorry. I'm surprised hearing this kind of rhetoric coming from you Spider. This would be like saying that since no one has ever proved the existence of then there cannot be a God. All concepts of God are fraud. Sorry You're starting to sound like Funches.
People who believe in God can hardly say that anything that has not yet been proven is a fraud. That very sentiment would deny their own faith in the supernatural world. No one had ever proven that praying works either. So by your reasoning then prayer is a fraud. Sorry. (I'm not claiming this, I'm just saying that this is in-line with your reasoning here that anything unproven is necessarily fraudulent.) What he said. 
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I get sick to my stomach when I read the drivel that you type. I don't see how you can even hit "Post Topic" after typing that crap. How rude. Try some Pepto Bismol it might help soothe your stomach.
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Okay now for Spider who claims that someone offered a million dollars to anyone who can prove that "supernatural" (whatever that is) exists... and asserts that nothing supernatural can exist because nobody has stepped up to claim the prize... well, do you know how many times I have heard this silly argument?
That no one has claimed the prize .. well I don't know that for a fact. That anyone has proven it... I don't know that for a fact either. This is just a statement I have no further details on it. So its not proof of anything. If I were serious about attempting to claim that prize I would have to know the specifics of what would be acceptable proof? What is the definition of supernatural, and how does that differ from supernormal? I would be very skeptical of anyone making this offer in the first place. So what is supernatural? Ghosts? Time travel? Predicting the future? Bending spoons? Walking on water? Coming back from the dead? Healing cancer? Reading minds? Capturing a live alien? Or are aliens not considered "supernatural?" Are angels and God considered super natural? These would be some of the question I would have to ask,not to mention what extent of proof would be required to convince this skeptic to part with one million dollars. (Which isn't really a lot of money these days, I think I would ask for a billion to see my proof.
JB |
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Edited by
Abracadabra
on
Mon 06/02/08 04:19 PM
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I think I would ask for a billion to see my proof.
JB That's a good point. The argument assumes that the person who could prove the supernatural ability even cares to. I think is the line with the of thinking of religious people who are trying to convince everyone that they their religions are true. If they could come up with proof of their religion they'd be shoving it down everyone's throats for free! Which just confirms that they clearly don't have any proof or they'd be flaunting it. On the other hand, people who can prove their supernatural abilities may not even be interested in proving them. In fact, they may not even be willing to prove them at any price. Just because the skeptics can find frauds who claim to be able to do these things but can't do them doesn't mean that there can't be legitimate people who can do these things. After all, if a skeptic offers a large sum of money for anyone who can prove their supernatural abilities there are certainly going to be a lot of crackpots trying out for the cash. That should be expected. So the whole argument wasn't very well thought out. |
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JREF One Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge
http://www.randi.org/joom/million-dollar-challenge-blog/challenge-correspondance/million-challenge-e-mail-blog-3.html This post will probably be deleted, for some reason not known to me. But you can see the million dollar challenge above. James Randi...google him. That no one has claimed the prize .. well I don't know that for a fact. That anyone has proven it... I don't know that for a fact either. This is just a statement I have no further details on it. The proof is above, but it won't change your concrete mind. A whole lot of good it will do you. For someone with an "open mind", it seems you only have a closed mind to reality. |
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I think I would ask for a billion to see my proof.
JB That's a good point. The argument assumes that the person who could prove the supernatural ability even cares to. I think is the line with the of thinking of religious people who are trying to convince everyone that they their religions are true. If they could come up with proof of their religion they'd be shoving it down everyone's throats for free! Which just confirms that they clearly don't have any proof or they'd be flaunting it. On the other hand, people who can prove their supernatural abilities may not even be interested in proving them. In fact, they may not even be willing to prove them at any price. Just because the skeptics can find frauds who claim to be able to do these things but can't do them doesn't mean that there can't be legitimate people who can do these things. After all, if a skeptic offers a large sum of money for anyone who can prove their supernatural abilities there are certainly going to be a lot of crackpots trying out for the cash. That should be expected. So the whole argument wasn't very well thought out. You have something on your nose there... |
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Edited by
Jeanniebean
on
Mon 06/02/08 08:12 PM
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JREF One Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge http://www.randi.org/joom/million-dollar-challenge-blog/challenge-correspondance/million-challenge-e-mail-blog-3.html This post will probably be deleted, for some reason not known to me. But you can see the million dollar challenge above. James Randi...google him. That no one has claimed the prize .. well I don't know that for a fact. That anyone has proven it... I don't know that for a fact either. This is just a statement I have no further details on it. The proof is above, but it won't change your concrete mind. A whole lot of good it will do you. For someone with an "open mind", it seems you only have a closed mind to reality. Why do you say that this post will probably be deleted? Are we having a persecution complex or something? I did not doubt what you said was true, spider. I just said I knew nothing about it and that I have heard this claim before. I just wasn't interested in it. I'm still not interested in it. (I don't know why you would be either.) If you take this as proof that no supernatural exists, then that means that God does not exist, Jesus does not exist, angels do not exist and Satan does not exist, the holy spirit does not exist, the holy ghost does not exist, immaculate conception cannot happen, Biblical miracles never happened, on and on. So what is it you are trying to accomplish and who are you trying to convince? Just wondering. JB |
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Everything is true.
Even false things?
Even false things are true.
How can that be?
I don't know man, I didn't do it.
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ok, new question. 1/10 delay is due to an optical response which is due to a biological mechanism. The eyes, nerves and brain are what are involved with this action. There are parts of the brain that we still do not know how they function or understand exactly what the reactions are for. What if foresight or precognition of the future doesn't involve the eyes at all. When you close your eyes you can see an image without having to see it with your eyes. In dreams we see images and movements and scenes, that we haven't ever experienced first hand before. Could foresight come from something not linked directly to us? From God or from some kind of spiritual entitiy or entities? (I read tarot too! and have freaked out maybe ppl on their readings! But tarot is a tool best used to guide one in the future not necessarily as a future telling device.) Everything that has,was,is,or going to happen - has already taken place, were just stuck for the most part with the present tense of happenings.There is no future, or past, just present as we understand the term present in our daily lives.So if someone "see's" into what they consider "future event's" they are doing no more than seeing something that has already taken place already. there is no mystery to this = citation - trueness of being (c) 1996 CLC SQP. |
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JREF One Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge http://www.randi.org/joom/million-dollar-challenge-blog/challenge-correspondance/million-challenge-e-mail-blog-3.html This post will probably be deleted, for some reason not known to me. But you can see the million dollar challenge above. James Randi...google him. That no one has claimed the prize .. well I don't know that for a fact. That anyone has proven it... I don't know that for a fact either. This is just a statement I have no further details on it. The proof is above, but it won't change your concrete mind. A whole lot of good it will do you. For someone with an "open mind", it seems you only have a closed mind to reality. Why do you say that this post will probably be deleted? Are we having a persecution complex or something? I did not doubt what you said was true, spider. I just said I knew nothing about it and that I have heard this claim before. I just wasn't interested in it. I'm still not interested in it. (I don't know why you would be either.) If you take this as proof that no supernatural exists, then that means that God does not exist, Jesus does not exist, angels do not exist and Satan does not exist, the holy spirit does not exist, the holy ghost does not exist, immaculate conception cannot happen, Biblical miracles never happened, on and on. So what is it you are trying to accomplish and who are you trying to convince? Just wondering. JB It's absolute proof that anyone who has made a public claim about having paranormal powers is a liar. |
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